Comments on: Is God the only murderer? https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/ Thought-provoking commentary on life, politics, religion and social issues. Wed, 27 Jun 2007 21:47:01 +0000 hourly 1 By: Kim Siever https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30774 Wed, 27 Jun 2007 21:47:01 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30774 re saying that they really didn’t do any preparing to meet God.</p> </blockquote> <p>No, I am saying they didn't use this life to do any preparing to meet God.</p> <blockquote> <p>So, I’m wondering, in your opinion, how much experience someone needs to have in order for life to have been a time of preparation?</p> </blockquote> <p>I don't know. Presumably sometime around eight years old, but I would guess God would ultimately be the judge of that since he can discern thoughts, intents, desires, and the like.</p> <blockquote> <p>Does someone need to experience the sensation of their five senses at least once?</p> </blockquote> <p>As a mortal? I don't think so. Assuming of course, we have all five senses once resurrected.</p> <blockquote> <p>Does someone need to be able to make a single decision, or perhaps a dozen?</p> </blockquote> <p>I presume it would be related to how much preparation the person made in the premortal life.</p> <blockquote> <p>It is related to opportunities to commit sin?</p> </blockquote> <p>Exclusively? I doubt it.</p> ]]>

If we take the case of the infant who dies a day after birth, you’re saying that they really didn’t do any preparing to meet God.

No, I am saying they didn’t use this life to do any preparing to meet God.

So, I’m wondering, in your opinion, how much experience someone needs to have in order for life to have been a time of preparation?

I don’t know. Presumably sometime around eight years old, but I would guess God would ultimately be the judge of that since he can discern thoughts, intents, desires, and the like.

Does someone need to experience the sensation of their five senses at least once?

As a mortal? I don’t think so. Assuming of course, we have all five senses once resurrected.

Does someone need to be able to make a single decision, or perhaps a dozen?

I presume it would be related to how much preparation the person made in the premortal life.

It is related to opportunities to commit sin?

Exclusively? I doubt it.

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By: JM https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30750 Wed, 27 Jun 2007 14:28:05 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30750 Well,

If we take the case of the infant who dies a day after birth, you’re saying that they really didn’t do any preparing to meet God.

So, I’m wondering, in your opinion, how much experience someone needs to have in order for life to have been a time of preparation? There must be a cutoff or a threshold.

And, what counts as experience? Does someone need to experience the sensation of their five senses at least once? Does someone need to be able to make a single decision, or perhaps a dozen? It is related to opportunities to commit sin?

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By: Kim Siever https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30740 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 22:03:35 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30740 s a necessary step, therefore part of the preparation.</p> </blockquote> <p>Sure. Having a body is necessary. Doing anything beyond that is not. Or rather, it's not necessary for everyone.</p> <blockquote> <p>What would be the experience threshold for preparation?</p> </blockquote> <p>I'm not sure I understand what you are asking.</p> ]]>

I have just always thought that it’s a necessary step, therefore part of the preparation.

Sure. Having a body is necessary. Doing anything beyond that is not. Or rather, it’s not necessary for everyone.

What would be the experience threshold for preparation?

I’m not sure I understand what you are asking.

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By: JM https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30730 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 19:53:02 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30730 So Kim,

What would be the experience threshold for preparation?

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By: JM https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30721 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 17:39:04 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30721 t see how something that is a free gift is part of our own efforts to prepare to meet God. "</p> <p>I can see where you're coming from. I have just always thought that it's a necessary step, therefore part of the preparation.</p> ]]> “I also don’t see how something that is a free gift is part of our own efforts to prepare to meet God. “

I can see where you’re coming from. I have just always thought that it’s a necessary step, therefore part of the preparation.

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By: Kim Siever https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30709 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 16:47:14 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30709 Perhaps, but I don’t think that’s what Amulek meant when he said “labors”.

I also don’t see how something that is a free gift is part of our own efforts to prepare to meet God. After all, Amulek says, “this life is the time for men to prepare to meet God”, not for God to prepare men to meet him.

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By: JM https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30700 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 14:59:38 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30700 Cool, I can live with that (being wrong).

But I disagree about the first thing. A part of preparing to meet God involves getting our mortal body, experiencing the second estate, and dying.

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By: Kim Siever https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30699 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 14:53:33 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30699 t do all the preparing that was necessary for them to do?</p> </blockquote> <p>Right. Which means, this life wasn't the time for him/her to meet God. That preparation was done before or will be done in the Spirit World.</p> <p>Perhaps we are both saying the same thing.</p> <blockquote> <p>. . . you are evaluating the experiences you have had in your life. You are evaluating how much you have learned and how beneficial that would be to someone else. You are then concluding that anyone who is deprived of similar experiences isn’t getting all of the benefit out of life that they could have.</p> <p>Correct me if I’m wrong . . . </p> </blockquote> <p>You're wrong. ;)</p> ]]>

If an infant lives to be a day old and then dies of natural causes, who is to say that this infant didn’t do all the preparing that was necessary for them to do?

Right. Which means, this life wasn’t the time for him/her to meet God. That preparation was done before or will be done in the Spirit World.

Perhaps we are both saying the same thing.

. . . you are evaluating the experiences you have had in your life. You are evaluating how much you have learned and how beneficial that would be to someone else. You are then concluding that anyone who is deprived of similar experiences isn’t getting all of the benefit out of life that they could have.

Correct me if I’m wrong . . .

You’re wrong. ;)

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By: JM https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30693 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 13:45:31 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30693 And the point I was making is that we are not the ones who define what an individuals preparation needs to be. That belongs to God.

If an infant lives to be a day old and then dies of natural causes, who is to say that this infant didn’t do all the preparing that was necessary for them to do?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but you are evaluating the experiences you have had in your life. You are evaluating how much you have learned and how beneficial that would be to someone else. You are then concluding that anyone who is deprived of similar experiences isn’t getting all of the benefit out of life that they could have.

But the unknown here is that we don’t know what experiences each individual needs to prepare to meet God. For that infant, all they could need by way of preparation would be that single day they were given. We really have no way of knowing.

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By: Kim Siever https://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/comment-page-1/#comment-30690 Tue, 26 Jun 2007 13:16:41 +0000 http://www.ourthoughts.ca/2007/06/22/is-god-the-only-murderer/#comment-30690 The point I was making is that this life isn’t a time to prepare to meet God for those who die before the age of accountability and for those who never hear the gospel. So, the idea that this life is the time to prepare to meet God isn’t an absolute one.

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