Comments on: Which are true

By: JM

JM — Tue, 27 Jun 2006 05:28:54 +0000

I think the only way to determine the truth of something unseen like Alma says, would be to receive a confirmation of the spirit.

By: Kim Siever

Kim Siever — Mon, 26 Jun 2006 19:32:38 +0000

Can you expound a little, Matt. What are you trying to address with the link?

By: Matt

Matt — Mon, 26 Jun 2006 19:29:39 +0000

I didn’t want to take up the whole page with this one comment so I’ll direct you to the source. This is perhaps my most favored chapter in the Book of Mormon. Especially from verse 26 on down.

http://scriptures.lds.org/alma/32

Matt.

By: Kim Siever

Kim Siever — Fri, 10 Feb 2006 15:23:50 +0000

“The second, and I believe smaller, component of faith is faith based on hope”

Mormon said it is the other way around in Moro 7:40â€“42:

“How is it that ye can attain unto faith, save ye shall have hope? And what is it that ye shall hope for? Behold I say unto you that ye shall have hope through the atonement of Christ and the power of his resurrection, to be raised unto life eternal, and this because of your faith in him according to the promise. Wherefore, if a man have faith he must needs have hope; for without faith there cannot be any hope.”

By: Bookslinger

Bookslinger — Mon, 30 Jan 2006 23:19:16 +0000

“So how does one determine something is true before developing faith in it?”

We don’t. We have to experiment. There’s a little trial and error involved.

I like Lamoni’s father’s prayer of faith: “O God, Aaron hath told me that there is a God; and if there is a God, and if thou art God, wilt thou make thyself known unto me, …”

His prayer is such an experiment. We can experiment upon the spoken words of others or upon the words of the scriptures. We can then either proceed or alter course based on the results of the experiment.

By: Eric

Eric — Mon, 30 Jan 2006 17:29:35 +0000

I don’t know if this adds anything or not. There are a lot of things out there that are true that I have not seen or personally verified. This includes things like the existance of God and the existance of Australia – never seen either. I have faith that they are there.

Also, I think Alma is talking about ways other than sight to gain knowledge. I have had spiritual experiences that lead me to say that I know that Christ is the Savior. I have not had that knowledge through sight but through other means. But just because my eyes have not seen something does not mean it is not true.

By: Kim Siever

Kim Siever — Mon, 30 Jan 2006 15:28:26 +0000

“he is talking about developing faith in things that are real and true.”

Doesn’t that entail we determine beforehand what is real and true? If we are to develop faith in that which is real and true and not in that which is false or pretend, then it stands to reason that we somehow need to determine what is real and not and what is true and not.

By: Kurt

Kurt — Mon, 30 Jan 2006 15:24:37 +0000

Alma is referring to things “that are true” in the sense that they exist, are real, and are independent facts which do not rely on anything else for their existence or veracity.

For example, “the Lord exists” is a true statement regardless of whether I believe it or not, have faith in it or no. He is independent of us and is real, whether we believe it or not.

Alma isnt talking about discerning truth first and then developing faith, he is talking about developing faith in things that are real and true. Establishing something to be real and true beforehand is not what Alma is suggesting.

By: ltbugaf

ltbugaf — Mon, 30 Jan 2006 07:47:28 +0000

If you could determine that something is true before exercising faith in it, you would have no need of faith.

By: Bradley Ross

Bradley Ross — Mon, 30 Jan 2006 05:01:25 +0000

I think there are two components of faith. The largest component of faith rests on knowledge. Put simply, I have faith in things that I have some evidence for. The second, and I believe smaller, component of faith is faith based on hope. I expect that the part of faith that is hope-based is a natural extension of the other type of faith. We can have a pretty reasonable expectation that the thing is true because it is connected to the faith we have that already rests on knowledge.

It is easier to have faith to move a mountain, for example, when God has revealed to you that he will do it. You have faith-knowledge, based on your revelation, that God will help you in your task. You also have faith-knowledge in God’s past demonstrations of power. You only have faith-hope in how the actual moving of the mountain will occur.