Comments on: Opposition in Probation

By: Kathleen Matheson Weber

Kathleen Matheson Weber — Thu, 16 Aug 2007 08:37:03 +0000

We may have been told that this world would be tying, but like a child told not to swim in contaminated water, then going on and doing it–how could we understand the concept of consequences if we’d never had any
expeience of them. Besides, I’ve never heard we had any choice whether or not to come here eventually–we were arguing about the terms.

By: rick

rick — Tue, 14 Aug 2007 15:09:45 +0000

No kidding. ;)

By: JM

JM — Tue, 14 Aug 2007 00:39:41 +0000

God plays by different rules.

By: Kim Siever

Kim Siever — Tue, 14 Aug 2007 00:19:52 +0000

Iâ€m responsible for the initial conditions, and I have a fair idea whatâ€s going to happen when I drop it.

For the parallel to exist, either God created Hurricane Katrina specifically, or the person who created the anvil (not the person who drops it) would be responsible for any damage.

If the scenario doesnâ€t hold true, then your God is certainly smaller that the God in the old testament.

Assuming of course that all those actions are literal, but that's another post, I think.

By: rick

rick — Mon, 13 Aug 2007 23:15:52 +0000

God made shearing winds, and knew the implications of such.

Given the assumption that He set the initializing conditions of the Universe and has the ability to see/predict the outcomes of all people and things in the Universe I don't see how that is any different that hanging an anvil out a third story window.

I'm responsible for the initial conditions, and I have a fair idea what's going to happen when I drop it.

If the scenario doesn't hold true, then your God is certainly smaller that the God in the old testament. Maybe that's the case.

By: Kim Siever

Kim Siever — Mon, 13 Aug 2007 21:10:14 +0000

I don't think your analogy holds, rick. It's not like God started Hurricane Katrina.

By: Mary Siever

Mary Siever — Mon, 13 Aug 2007 19:22:31 +0000

No, sorry don't see the connection there. Dropping an anvil isn't the same as letting the forces of nature be in control. Basically it would like saying whatever YOU create, you manually control (i.e. a computer programme that malfunctions) and will always make it do what it is supposed to do. You CAN change it, but you won't always do so. Ok, might not be a perfect example, but again, I do find it amusing when humans think they know better than God.

By: rick

rick — Mon, 13 Aug 2007 15:08:50 +0000

So, Mary, if I drop an anvil from a balcony, I can't be held responsible because it's gravity doing the damage, right? I had the ability to identify and avoid the consequences and I choose not to. That puts me in the same position as God in the previous scenario.

By: Mary Siever

Mary Siever — Mon, 13 Aug 2007 14:22:08 +0000

Rick

How does it fly in the face of God being all powerful? Just because He can do everything, doesn't mean He doesn't allow natural law, which He created to take effect. Part of being all-powerful is having the wisdom to allow natural consequences and sometimes there are lessons that need to be learned, and reasons we don't know about.

I have to admit I have had some pretty minor trials compared to most, but while going through some of them they didn't seem so minor. It was afterwards I realised why they happened and the wisdom in allowing these things to happen.

It always amuses me when humans think they are wiser than God.

By: rick

rick — Sun, 12 Aug 2007 21:36:52 +0000

"[that] doesnâ€t mean that Heavenly Father and/or Mother are doing it to us. Stuff happens."

This pretty much flies in the face of God being the all-powerful creator of the Universe. Is willfully not intervening the same as being responsible for the act?